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The Future of ImDeity

Discussion in 'Suggestions / Ideas' started by Wilven, April 7, 2015.

  1. Wilven

    Wilven

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    The Future of ImDeity
    I wish to make an open discussion on the current direction of the server and the future of ImDeity as a community and Minecraft server.

    I want to start with a disclaimer: I am not trying to make accusations or digs at any player/town/staff member. Over the time I have been playing on this server, I have noticed a few areas that I feel the community and management of the server should take a closer look at to potentially improve the experience of new players joining the server, and those of us who have been here for a while.

    I want to talk about how the server currently feels to new players and how we could improve their experience. I want to talk about how the server may have too many restrictions on what the player can do, and how that may affect their opinions on ImDeity. I am going to talk about potentially controversial subjects pertaining to the server but I will also list some solutions/changes I think would be beneficial.

    The New Player Experience
    A players first impressions of a server are the most important. It gives them an instant idea on what to expect from the server: How friendly the players are, how helpful the staff are, and how easy it is to start playing and enjoy themselves. I feel as though the server currently does 2 of those 3 very well but we struggle when it comes to making it easy for players to get started and have fun.

    Too Much At Once
    One thing that is great about our community is how welcoming we are. However, when a new player joins, it can be a little intimidating and manipulating. Currently, when a new player joins, they are bombarded with private messages asking them to join their town; how much they can do for them and give to them for joining. Some even take it a step forward and head to spawn as soon as they join to add them to their town before anyone else gets a chance. I feel this is leading towards players taking part in bad practice when it comes to recruiting for their towns. New players aren’t being treated as new players. They are treated as assets; items that towns are adding to their inventory. It’s no longer about creating a community, It’s about numbers, profit and bragging rights.
    We’re all guilty of it, but we all need to make an effort to change this, through our own ability and potentially through the help of Staff members to enforce new rules.

    Jumping Through Hoops
    When a new player joins the server, they have to complete 3 to 4 steps be able to enjoy the server to it’s fullest.

    1. Before a player can claim a plot in their town or pick a class, they have to register on the website.
    2. Once they have done that, they need to vote for the server in order to afford a plot.
    3. They have to go to the website to select a class before they can do simple things like enchanting or placing water.
    4. Before they can get even pick a class they need to get 2 days registerd time, 2 votes, and 2 forum posts.
    When it comes to #2, many of you might say that we should just give away free plots instead. The problem I have with that is the upkeep and cost of purchasing plots for your town is already really expensive, and selling plots should be seen as a source of income for that.

    I feel that because we force new players to go through this lengthy process before they can play is bad for a couple of reasons. First, making players have to go through this lengthy process before they can play reduces the chance that they will stay with us for and long amount of time. Secondly, like I said earlier, first impressions are everything and if a player can't jump straight in and have fun, they aren’t going to stay. We promote this server as a family friendly server, which means we have a lot of children that play. I think asking children to supply their own email is a little bit too much to ask for some of them.

    Additionally, lots of people play on servers with their friends. When we lose one player due to a bad first impression, we lose everybody they would potentially bring with them too.

    Limitations and Their Effect
    The server has a lot of interesting custom plugins that make us unique. One of which is the class system. However, being able to choose between 3 classes may sound great on the outside, but I feel the current system does more bad than good.

    Adding Features or Taking Away?
    My philosophy when it comes to multiplayer servers is that they should always add features to a players experience, rather than take them away. A perfect example of what I am talking about is the Craftsman Rank.

    Currently players with the Craftsman rank are the old ones who are able to enchant tools and brew potions. They’re the also the only ones who are able to place certain common blocks such as Ice, Railways and Redstone related items. And to be able to do these, the player has to rank up a couple of times first. To me, these are not features of the Craftsman rank: They are basic features that have been removed from the base game. On the other hand, the craftsman does add some features to the player. A Perfect example would be creating lift signs. To me this is what the classes should be. They should add features to a players experience, rather than limit them to what they can do. Else why would they play multiplayer and be limited when they can just play single player and be able to enchant their own tools?
    I feel players should be able to do everything that is in the base game, and have class ranks add custom features that are actual benefits.

    Unobtainables: Why?
    Currently in game, there are a whole bunch of common items that are unavailable to collect in conventional ways. Items such as Quartz, Glowstone, Netherrack, Gold and endstone have to be crafted with custom recipes (extremely expensive ones at that) rather than collected because their respective worlds are disabled.

    While the custom crafting system is great and a lot of time has been spent on it, I feel as though it was a solution to a problem that didn’t need to exist. It almost comes as a standard now that survival/towny/factions servers have nether and End world for players to explore and collect in. I don’t see why it would become a problem for this server if they were enabled.

    Suggestions to Solutions
    When it comes to new players joining the server, I think if we made it so that they could join a town and get a plot without registering, at least that would be a start. The more we allow them to do without having to register, the better.

    In terms of Classes and Ranks, I think all players should be able to do everything that is in the base game. Everybody should be able to enchant their tools. Everyone should be able to create potions. Classes should add features that are complete new additions to the game such as selling horses or Bridge/Lift signs.

    Your Feedback
    I have created a small Anonymous poll to gather feedback. Please be completely honest. This is just to have an overall idea on how people feel about the topics I have brought up here.

    CLICK HERE FOR THE POLL

    Thanks for taking the time to read this excessively large topic.

    -Wilven
     
    Last edited: April 7, 2015
  2. Gwenhywar

    Gwenhywar

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    Hello Wilven,
    I like to reply shortly to the first things that come to my head when I read your thread. This will not be a completed review on all of your ideas, I might come to this at a later point, when I have more time.

    This server is supposed to be a server with towns, ranks and perks for people that have a rank or a class. Due to several issues with players not registering and the link between the portal and the game, we need the registration to have people in the towns and being able to count them and their perks and such. Further more the "vote to get a plot" part is not in every town. A lot of newby friendly towns still give plots for free as far as I know and even give their own kind of starter kit.

    With the concept of ranks there is the question which perks you want to give. Those perks have to be kind of game changing and relevant, if not, we would not have classes. I personally like the concept of those classes and can still say that the craftsmen class is one of the most loved one because it has so many perks (however I am vendor). The only downside of craftsmen has always been they could not really make money which Nobles and Merchants can, if they act smart. Still by far easier than Craftsman.

    That people leave the server fast is not true in my eyes. That it happend before is true and ofc it will still happen, but mostly it was about no real introduction on the server given. I am not familiar with the current numbers but since we had special features as classes, I know for a fact that we had more new players.

    Ofc you are right, you have to make a choice to want to be on this server, but in my eyes as much as on every other server.

    Just my five cent to it. :) However, I can say what I said in your anonymous poll. I gave a two. I like your way to think and try to give reasoning to it, I want to honor your effort in writing this post. And ofc you are also right, that it is not as easy here as on other servers, but I think that brings the fun on the server. :)

    Best regards,
    Gwenhywar
     
  3. heinz_gruber

    heinz_gruber

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    In my time here, there has been no greater topic of discussion between me and my peers.

    It is great that so many players care so much that they suggest big ideas to improve things.

    To be honest with Wilven i do somewhat agree with him, the grass does indeed sound greener, doesnt it?

    However the realist in me recognize's that it is Deity's server, and he has made it this way for his own reasons.

    I hope that many of my own suggestions would become a reality, but lets face it, everyone wants the server to be made in their own image.
    Everyone likes to play god, but there is only 1 Deity. This was never a democracy, it is a Deitocracy. But knowing him as i do from my time here, i would choose the latter any day, he is fair and generous, and i would say that although we are not mega close, i would still count him as a friend because he has always looked out for me.

    With some luck he will see your suggestion, it would be refreshing to hear his stance on some of these issues again.

    Happy trails xD
     
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  4. Wilven

    Wilven

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    Yeah it is good to remember that at the end of the day this is Deity's server and it is his choice on how he wants to run it. He has final say and if he has an opinion he feels strongly about then who am I to challenge him on it.

    However I just feel that with the community as large as this, it is good to listen to the community and take feedback based on what they say. Hence why I made a poll. It's an easy way for us to see what the communities opinion is on this subject and remain anonymous for fear of upsetting certain people with their point of view.
     
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  5. BarryX15

    BarryX15

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    Thank you for pointing at this bad habit, however the problem is that this isnt against rules, this is only an issue with morals and manners. And as long as there are benefits from recruiting (tax, plot limit or even just bragging) we have to deal with this or rather to get over this.

    Tip for shortening the process a bit: forget about classes and posting on forums. Nobody has to learn everything the first day, all that newbies need is food, tools, armor and storage, in this order. I consider points 3 and 4 as "advanced stuff". And side note about water - most people dont need placing water at all if you teach them to use town farm, and the rest can be served by an assistant with craftsman class.



    These "basic features" have been removed because they can cause lag or be used as griefing tool. Believe it or not, these restictions are one of things that make this server friendly. I would like to see more added features but i really cannot think of any, at least for craftsman class.



    One of possible problems with Nether is that if you create a portal in the Nether, it creates another portal in the Overworld. Imagine someone creating a nether portal that goes directly into your storage room, replacing your diamond storage chest with a block of obsidian. And uhm... did i read Gold??



    If they are unable to register, they will most likely be unable to earn money to buy a plot...*shrugs shoulders

    The poll... is it so necessary to have it completely anonymous that you had to create it on some random website? You could have posted the poll in this thread, probably with same results..
     
  6. btarb24

    btarb24

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    I agree, thank you for confirming that this is a problem. When i logged in as my alt i received a town invite without even a /l or /w to say hello first. This is quite a rude practice. Plus, another thing i learned is that if you receive two town invites (even over an hour timespan) it will choose the first town when you do /accept. That was annoying. The following changes may be in order:
    1. You cannot send town invites while at the capital.
    2. Invites will timeout after a couple minutes
    3. I'm not quite sure which of the below routes will be best to take:
      1. Cannot do a town invite unless the player has already done a /t spawn
      2. Can only do town adds within x blocks of the town spawn
      3. Simply adding the aforementioned restriction of no town invites at the capital.

    Please keep in mind that the main motivation we had in returning the ability to use /town add was to make it easier on the new users. It was not to make it easier on the town staff to do recruiting.
     
  7. heinz_gruber

    heinz_gruber

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    I agree, and while I am also guilty of this, why would I stand back and let other towns collect all the new members?
    This is a problem and even though every member I recruit gets the same introduction to the town and the server, no one gets recruited surely as a number. When you have been running a town as long as I have, you appreciate that 1 member can make a difference, so each recruit is treated like gold blocks, however I am not at fault if they log out before I can finish getting them acclimated. But aggressive recruiting can be detrimental and it does shift the focus away from the player and towards the town. It is potentially harmful due to players competing in what I consider an unhealthy manner, it can also cause a rift between players who are trying hard to get the recruits. I would suggest that new players have to visit a town spawn and when they are there, there could be a sign that when clicked will send a town join request to the staff. That way it takes away the recruiting and shifts the focus so that new players are encouraged to explore and check out towns for themselves.

    We could have a simple update that means new players must choose a town for themselves instead of players messing around and competing in this way.
    We could go one step further, have a sign at Town spawns that can be used by players to request to join a town, alongside making it so town staff can send invites within town property.
    This would mean players can still apply to join a town they like via in game even if there are no town staff online
    If accessibility is our goal then we need multiple ways for players to get what they want. Instead of going back to website admissions only.

    The fact that btarb has made an appearance means deity will get some much needed help, and I for one applaud the man.

    These are just ideas that I would like to see tried out. But we all agree the current system is corrupted

    Btarb, I will be sending you a conversation
     
  8. BarryX15

    BarryX15

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    Yes, Yes, Yes. Replace /t add <player-name> for town staff with /t join <town-name> for players. If they can type /accept now, they will for sure be able to type longer command aswell.

    Other limitations and tweaks can follow (they have to stay in town spawn plot etc.) but this is the very first step on a long way to push people closer to good manners.
     
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  9. Wilven

    Wilven

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    The poll was made using that website so that it would be anonymous,allowing people to vote on how they really felt about these points, rather than what they think other players/staff will think of them.

    Edit: Also, straw poll is very well know and no exactly some random website. It is a very trustworthy site to use.

    Could you elaborate on why you feel players being able to make potions or enchant their tools without being a craftsman could contribute to greifing ?

    And a solution to the nether portals (as seen on most servers) is to just disable personal portals and have one at spawn.
     
    Last edited: April 8, 2015
  10. heinz_gruber

    heinz_gruber

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    Sticky pistons can grab blocks from outside your own slots and can be used for theft.

    That's just one example.
    I use sticky pistons as an example, only of things that can cause grief, but now i get your full meaning i can give you my thoughts.

    I do like the concept of your ideas, for everyone to have the same no matter what class, and then have extra additional things specific to those classes would be kinda nice.

    The only suggestion i would make is do you have any idea what those perks could be hypothetically?

    My question, would deity want to change the dynamic if he thought the outcome was better, possibly, probably, definitely maybe.

    As to whether your ideas are the right course for the server, well that is the one thing Deity can only answer xD we all have our ideas and lets face brass facts, everyone wants changes to suit their ideals, sure i think your idea is noble, and would love to hear more info on what these classes could potentially have xD
     
    Last edited: April 8, 2015
  11. Fiver26

    Fiver26

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    Just going on one of your points here as I have to get to class, but just searching nether in the threads gets you all the reasons why it's not implemented....
     
  12. Wilven

    Wilven

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    This point doesn't really make sense because sticky pistons are disabled for everyone, and for a reason.

    I understand why they are disabled, and I'm in now way making a plea to enable lava/fire and those sorts of items because they have an obvious greifng impact. What I am saying is items like railway tracks and water shouldn't be restricted to one certain class when they are available to every player in the base game. We should add features for players not limit them on what they could already do on another server or in single player. No one as of yet has really given a justified benefit of limiting players in this way.

    Some of you say that this is just how the server is and that it is not for everyone. With this attitude, the server will slowly lose its life due to other servers giving new and existing players a better experience.

    In response to the nether, yes I have read many threads regarding enabling the nether and have never seen a justifiable or un-fixable issue with enabling it.
     
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  13. Trekar_Sil

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    This particular "attitude" has been around for longer than you've been on the server, and as of yet I've seen no change in the numbers of players due to the current settings for player classes. The only major drop has been due to the clamor for a map reset as well as the issues with creative and pvp servers that have still not been fixed. There's been a select minority of players including yourself that predict the server will die if it doesn't change, but as of yet I haven't seen a difference, nor have I seen another server quite like Deity's that's as active, and trust me, I've looked.
     
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  14. Wilven

    Wilven

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    Yeah, Actually I'm not ashamed to do a little back peddling on what I've said so far. I actually don't think that what I am suggesting is necessary for the server to survive nor do I feel the server is going to die. It takes something special to have a server run for over 3 years and still be as successful as this server is.

    All I'm saying is that we could improve our community and gather new members much more easily if some things that are turning them away were changed.

    Edit: Sorry but I didn't appreciate the jab at my time on the server. I wasn't going to say because I wish this topic to stay on track, but I have been on and off this server since 2011, playing for perhaps 4-6 months at a time, so please don't act like I don't understand the community on this server.
     
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  15. Trekar_Sil

    Trekar_Sil

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    If you understood the community on the server, you would not have mentioned some of the stuff in your initial post, that being said, I apologize for assuming the length of time you've spent on the server.
     
  16. Wilven

    Wilven

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    On the contrary, I believe the poll so far says otherwise.
     
  17. Trekar_Sil

    Trekar_Sil

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    As the poll is anonymous, we don't know if those are veterans voting or people fresh off the boat.
     
  18. Wilven

    Wilven

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    Could you explain why that matters? Are new players not entitled to the same amount of say in matters as you and other veterans?

    It's new players joining that keeps the server alive. The people who join today become the veterans in 6 months time.
     
  19. Fiver26

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    not to be a bit of a downer, but with straw poll all you need is multiple devices and data connections to vote multiple times... also there is 43% of people in the 1/2 range so trying to say its going in your favor isnt really analyzing the data well
     
  20. Wilven

    Wilven

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    I have searched through some threads about the Nether and compiled a list of reasons given for why it is disabled.

    1. Lag
    While it is true that when the Nether was first added, it created a lot of problems for multiplayer. It was laggy, unstable, and full of bugs and duplication glitches.
    This doesn't really exist anymore though. The only way the Nether could potentially lag a server is if the server hardware it's self could not handle it. A server like this that can support 200 players but only ever has a maximum of around 40 at any time could easily support the Main world, Mine, Nether, and End without any problems.

    2. Portal Greifing
    There was worry that players could go into the Nether, create a portal in the right spot, and apear inside somebodies base in the main world, or replace a chest with the obsidian from the portal frame.
    The easy way to fix this is to take the same aproach many servers do. Disable personal portals and either add a portal at spawn to get to the Nether or a command like /Nether
    3. Don't Need It
    Quartz. Netherbrick, Soulsand, Netherwart, Blaze rods, Blaze powder, Ghast Tears, Magma Cream and Glowstone are all hugely sought after items that are only obtainable from the nether.
    Yes, we now have a custom crafting system which adds these items back in the game, but it is such an unnecessary and unconventional way to get them and often not worth it. The Nether is an essential part of the base game and players have shown a thousand items that they are interested in having access to it.

    He was saying that my post did not represent the community, while the poll clearly shows that a slight majority actually agree with me or at least a lot of what I have put.

    Also couldn't the same be said for the forums? If anything, vote manipulation would be easier on a forum as all you would need to do is create a new account. Not proxies required.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: April 8, 2015

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