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Discussion in 'Kingdoms General' started by Mojinax, May 23, 2016.

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  1. Mojinax

    Mojinax

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    "This is not a Democracy" - Said compliantly by idiots, and hopelessly by those powerless to do anything.

    Our server did not die because of a lack of interest in Minecraft, I've got living proof of a towny server that has 200+ people on at most times. What did they do that made them so popular? Added in a far more advanced class system, freedom for all people to make chest shops wherever they pleased, gave people keys for voting which could be used to open chests for a chance at armor, weapons, tools, or money, gave their people the freedom to roam the nether and find The End, allowed people free use of water, fire, lava, and redstone, kept MCMMO around, and made sure that their people would not get bored - Oh! And they're 1.9.4. In defense of being accused of "advertising", I am not giving out the IP.

    Our server? Let's just say that if all servers started out in the left lane, riding off the tailwind of the Minecraft (just the game) hype, at some point (2-3 years in) the driver decided to shift into the right lane instead. For all of you non-drivers (not you, Driver) who maybe don't get the reference - we slowed down big time. Queue "The server is dying" and "Moribund" in late 2014 (Sucks being right this time). We're in the right lane, we're speeding up, talk of map restart. Christmas 2014 and boom we crash going 40 on the highway. Everyone on the Deity bus is put into a coma where they think the server is good again. Over the next year, most of the people would wake up from the coma and get off the bus and walk away. Some wouldn't look back, others would with the thought "What a sad sight. Where did we go wrong?"

    Now, in the post apocalyptic right lane, some scavengers climb on to the bus to see if there's anything good, see Deity asleep in the driver seat (asleep, not in a coma), and like 3 or 4 avid players with tubes down their mouths for food and water, still in their comatose state. What can they expect for their dedication? Maybe a dev-created update or at the very least an update to 1.9? Probably just a change of their feeding tube - nothing special.

    Maybe we can all open our eyes together, those of you who may still have hope for this server? Ideally I'd love to see this thread make a change, but I think it has a much better chance of being locked or removed before anything productive can come of it. Sucks moving on. It's been three and a half good years, and one and a half crappy ones. Going way back, thank you Wilku for being an awesome person and an awesome mayor, and more recently than that, thank you Totalmoobs, Niall, and Fiver for being the closest people I've ever come to call friends on this server. I've few in number, it seems, but you guys make a world of difference.

    If anyone who's reading this still likes Minecraft, you can do better for yourselves than this. @Staff, if this statement is the one that crosses the line - feel free to remove it, not the thread.

    Edit: In the spirit of constructive criticism; how do you fix the server? Deity needs to wake up, push the curtain aside that veils him 360 degrees, start singing some road trip tunes and get into the left lane again. And for God's sake - get some staff that will speak up against you and LISTEN to them. A good amount of the staff are sheep, void of their own personality and basically little Deity's, and the other portion are foxes in sheep's clothes. They don't agree with you on a good amount of things, but apparently their moderator status means enough to them that they wouldn't dare risk it by speaking up.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2016
  2. BarryX15

    BarryX15

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    If a guy seriously needs or wants another guy to do something, he invites him to share a beer and talk. It usually works better than ranting on internet forums, at least in my country.
     
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  3. Mojinax

    Mojinax

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    I donated $25 to this server and had a chat with Deity soon after. It was not a productive conversation, and several months after - nothing has happened. Not from my $25 donation, not from my friendly conversation with him. What else do I do?
     
  4. Sephronia

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    Bolded for emphasis. This crossed lines. You were somehow able to insult all the server staff in less than two sentences whilst also being patronising. Good work, even for you.

    How could any of the server staff possibly have minds of their own, right? Only you have the intellect and courage to voice an opinion, right? Grow up.

    Don't presume that you have ANY idea what happens where you do not see.

    In conclusion, Baa.

    Many thanks,
    Seph
     
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  5. erorah

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  6. MasahiroRina

    MasahiroRina

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    I don't think this server is dead. I like it quiet, as I am more comfortable making friends in small groups of relatively mature people. If I wanted to get lost in the rush of hundreds of strange kids I would go back to the kitty-cat themed server I was on before imdeity. However, I find that dealing with newbies who like to poke holes in the landscape is a real pain, and that's not even mentioning the ones who beg for help without even having played single-player mode once. I'm glad we have a minimum of that. Instead, here we have adults who are willing to spend real money to support a server that encourages actual creativity and art, where people carefully design machines that are designed to be functional with a minimum of server load and placement, where there is also almost no griefing that I've heard of, especially since we don't mine in the same world we build in.

    I think you're worrying too much. If Deity (or any of the admins, really) started posting stuff about running out of money to host the server - at that point it would be acceptable to suggest methods of attracting new faces. Until then, let's just properly grow our group of friends - actual relationships, annoying drama and all.

    If you want to play on a server like the one you mentioned so badly, why aren't you playing on that one? Something brought you back here. Figure out what it is, and remember that all things come at a cost.

    -Rina

    PS: I love the video game Minecraft so much I'm willing to play it by myself. Vanilla. On PC, Xbox 360, PS4, PS Vita, or even on my decrepit tablet. I have only ever joined and maintained an account on a public server because I liked the particular community that it possesses, and I felt like they're people worth learning from and trying to impress. (well, except skyblock, because installing the modpack is a pain.) So yeah, you don't really know me, so you really can't say what I like best. ✌

    PPS: why is your attempt at 'constructive criticism' an afterthought? If you had actually cared about the people you play with, I am certain that you would have phrased things a little more politely throughout your post. Also, please refresh your understanding of the term - you kinda missed the hoop entirely.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2016
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  7. Mojinax

    Mojinax

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    Thought this kind of response might come up... I don't play on this server anymore. In fact, I do play on the other one and FTB on the side. I made this thread as my last little "hurrah", a goodbye of sorts. Some people will say I find enjoyment out of doing stuff like this, some will say I just like to create drama - Both are true to an extent. Really, this thread is a spawn of my frustration with how the server has been run. If I thought I could control myself (word it without getting banned/thread removed), I would have addressed the idiocy that is the people who let the server sink from 50+ players on at a time. You see, while you like playing with small groups and "enjoying the quiet", the majority of the people who have quit left because of exactly the opposite. Is it greedy of me to want the 50+, 75+ players back? Sure. But it's equally as greedy of you to want a small community. That can be accomplished in a town. Get 2-3 friends and enjoy. It would be very very very hard to get 50+ active people in a town now to create a sense of a large community. Money's not the issue. I've heard several times that Deity picked up the tab on many occasions. I've come to realize that most of the counterarguments come from your type of people, one in particular whom I know would not appreciate being called out. I can't remember a thread where someone had a good idea, and there was no one to counter it. And half the times I honestly don't believe those people who argue against it really care - I think they're just in it for the kicks (to get their little writing/drama bug out). I know I do the same thing when I play devil's advocate on some threads. But I attribute much of the failure (from a person who wants 50+ people on) of the server to those who wish to have a small community... Again - you CAN have a small community. Make a town, invite your friends - don't hold the server to having that little of people. But that's the soft wall. The hard wall is whether Deity chooses to do something or not, and wondering if Deity would ever go for it has stunted most of my suggestions.

    tl;dr : Make a small town and have your own little community. There's no reason that the server should have to be held to 10-20 people.

    Response to first PS: I join servers for the same reason. I build for recognition. Less people to recognize = less interest I have in the server.

    Response to second PS: As I said, I don't really play anymore, and the only people I care to look out for anymore are the three I mentioned in the initial post. I'm not trying to be kind or polite - I'm making a point. You gotta break a few bones if you want to be heard.

    Well I'm glad you took offense. Maybe it'll produce some self reflection thought for you.

    Time and time again with that same, stupid, crappy line "You don't know what goes on behind the scenes." No. Duh. Barely anything comes to the forefront (dev patches, minecraft updates, etc.) and we NEVER hear anything behind the scenes. It's like sitting at a play that's running 30 minutes late without anyone telling you why. What do you do as an audience member? Sit there like an idiot and wait patiently, unperturbed as the director and producers would like you to be in the situation? It could take a minute - it could take 2 hours. No one knows because no one will say anything, and the director would be an idiot to be surprised or disgusted by people walking out or getting pissed over the situation.

    And grow up? Really? You're really that offended that THAT is your tactic? You put words in my mouth that I did not say ("Only you have the intellect and courage to voice an opinion, right?") and then call me a child... NONE of you are qualified to be moderators (when compared to a job in PR, something that seems very similar). ALL of you have reason to want to stay moderator, which is power and status. These stem from your thoughts too, I know that for sure - you're just normal people with an extra curtain to hide behind where you can talk with other staff members ("Don't presume that you have ANY idea what happens where you do not see."). But you were appointed for a reason, so you've earned that, right? You were appointed by someone who took a server that was thriving, and under his control it went down to 10-20 players average on a good day. If all the people that left the server were instead permanent citizens (Could not leave ImDeity easily [Owned a house there, had a family there, had a job {Like living in a country, can still leave but you'll be leaving behind your life}]) under the regime that is ImDeity's - there would instead be revolt. Instead, they're allowed the simple option to disconnect and never connect again.

    Statistics apply to all things. Statistically, we are worse off player-base-wise than we were before. According to Dinnerbone, an employee (or former employee, I don't care) at Minecraft, a statistic of numbers of players playing minecraft is this; (Posted Jan 9, 2015)
    [​IMG]

    I will gratefully lower that number down to 750,000 - or 500,000 (just for you), and like he said; that's not even NEAR peak times. I'll go with the lesser number, on non-peak times. So of the 500,000 people, I'll very gratefully say 60,000 are interested in multiplayer servers. During our peak (30 players), that's .0005% of that population. That is how poor our advertising and appeal is. Now here's where I've been stumped 100 times over; Is it because we trust the server in the hands of someone who just isn't that good at recruiting/making good decisions for the server? Or does the person we trust that has our best interests at heart just not care about the server anymore? Or is he happy with how many players are around? Does he just like having 10-30 people on?

    That's fine by me if he does, I've left and found another server as a result of that. 10-30 people just is not for me, and I've accepted that. But I still post because I think he just doesn't know exactly what he's doing (Option 1). But I wouldn't know. Kept in the dark and all. Probably not deserving of that information. Only for mod's and admin's ears. Consequences of that? You lose the players who care about the well being of the server and are left with those who simply use the server, and honestly would just find another way to play if it went down. But it means you don't have to put in the effort of typing a paragraph a week.

    Where's my proof? Evidence? This server. Turns out I've got eyes that can see things and a brain that can put 2 and 2 together. Wondrous days we live in, eh?
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2016
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  8. MasahiroRina

    MasahiroRina

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    Most of the creative-driven servers that I have found are closed-community servers. They are, as you suggested, Mojinax, servers where a few irl friends have gotten together and created something awesome. However, I cannot create that, as I have a significant lack of IRL friends who play Minecraft. I have also already mentioned that I am uncomfortable making friends in large group settings, or rather I stated the inverse which should have led your logic to that conclusion, if you were using logic. Were I to create my town and isolate myself as per your suggestion, what would be the point of playing on a multiplayer server? I could just as easily run a server on my own computer!

    There's one more 'selling point' for this server for someone of my particular situation, and that is that this community in particular has a lot of "sleepers" - people who cannot be, or do not want to be, on frequently. Sure, maybe there's only ten or twenty people on at any given moment - but those people change constantly. I see 'new' names on the current list all the time, people returning from month-long absences, for instance, and oddly enough I rarely see those people active in the forums. I joined this server over a year ago specifically because I saw the statistic pattern that you find so much fault in. Guess what - adults have lives. Jobs. You know, real life things that take up our time away from the computer. And coming back to find drastic changes all the time - like what happens on SuPeR PoPuLaR servers - is disconcerting. It's just a game! Why are you taking this so seriously? Let people play the way they want to!

    See, you're wrong about me again. I understood this section of your wording to insinuate that I am a person who argues for the sake of arguing. In fact, as I have stated my preference of a settled, quiet server, where decisions are carefully considered and conservatively carried out, I think you would have realized that your "call to arms" to reshape the server into a disorderly, noisy, glutted, overpopulated server is something that I do not want for the sake of actually not wanting it. I don't play devil's advocate. Often I can be brought around to the point I'm arguing against (as debate is one of my learning styles), and just as often I'm disagreeing with some small segment of the platform that most people find unimportant, but I would never knowingly support something I disagreed with simply for the sake of argument. In this case I strongly feel that people like you are what drive the creative people (who I actually want to be around) into closed-community servers and prevent people (like me) from finding servers they actually enjoy playing on.


    Well, you have tried quite hard to cause offense. You must be quite proud of yourself from getting a rise out of a moderator known for rising to such occasions. (no offense meant, the pun was too good to pass up.) Also, you are being childish. You have now literally admitted that you are slamming the door as you exit the room - and that it is your intention. You are snarky and full of drama. I wouldn't bother to waste my time writing a response at all, except perhaps that your contradictions and inflammatory words have indeed caused the presumably desired reaction, and I therefore feel it necessary to remind the people running the server that at least some of the players on this server do not agree with you.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2016
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  9. Mojinax

    Mojinax

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    I take it seriously because this is where I've been for 5 years, and I hoped I wouldn't have to leave. The feeling you have in defense of having the server become populated again is the same one I have for it becoming this lifeless. So especially for me, it's my 5 years versus your 1 year. I played at the peak of the server the most, you play at it's weakest. In the middle is a fundamental difference in preferences. Your preference can survive in mine, but mine cannot exist in yours.

    Am I wrong for wanting that? Or are you wrong for not being able to adjust?

    Prime example of a small town in a big server - Veligrad. Whenever Barry built it, he made sure he took in people he liked and created a small community of good builders among titan towns like Doha.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2016
  10. ImDeity

    ImDeity

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    Ah, another thread where Deity needs to wake up and push the big green Go button so that plugins get upgraded to the latest greatest MC version, bugs get fixed, tickets get answered so "50-75 people" who've been waiting for said button to be pushed appear and everything is peachy again... or at least for the next couple weeks before someone gets bored and another one of these threads pop up.

    If we return to reality however, there is no magic button and even just maintaining this server's hardware & software takes a certain amount of work to be put in every week. To make upgrades every time MC decides that they need to break protocol and plugins to go from 1.9.27 to 1.9.28 requires even more work. To fully upgrade numerous plugins on every major release like 1.8 to 1.9 requires even more hours. On top of all this, I've also pushed thousands of dollars of my own money to pay the servers bills for the 5 years this server has been up (even with the generosity of the donors who have put thousands of dollars into this project, it is still very much a net negative operation in the -$10k+ range since the server was started).

    I've said this before but I'll repeat this since this kind of thread pops up every X months -- this server's goal was never to be some massive, packed server. Yes, at some points in the past, the server happened to hit some high population numbers and it was a fun ride while it lasted but maintaining that level requires significantly more development work/time to keep stable/updated and ever increasing amounts of paid advertising to maintain the public exposure).

    This server was simply started so my sister and I could play together back in the day and continues to exist as I find some interest in offering a place for a few people to come and play together.

    As long as this server has more than a couple of people on it, I will continue to put in varying amounts of work as my personal time permits to maintain it (and a number of our staff and players continue to help) so that people continue to have a place to do whatever interests them here. If this doesn't appeal to you, you are more than welcome to find a more suitable place but demanding anything more underestimates the amount of work going on behind the scenes and is simply unreasonable.
     
  11. Mojinax

    Mojinax

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    I wish you had said this a year or two ago. Finally answers my last and biggest question regarding the server.

    As two final thoughts; If you encounter more people like me, I suggest you simply speak your mind to them. Your moderator's words mean nothing to someone who understand you are the person who makes the difference, and instead their words usually cause more issue. This will give you less problems. Second piece is that you should consider getting a cheaper server to bring down those figures.

    Thank you for the clarity, and I wish you luck with the remainder of this server's life.

    Goodbye (or at least until FTB?)

    Edit: You have my permission to do what you will with this thread.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2016
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  12. erorah

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